Discussion Board Archives from 2003

Name: Ronald AaldersSubject: Onions vs. hoofpacking

Email: ronaldaalders@planet.nl

I was reading Hoofcare and Lameness (#77) magazine the other day and ran into an article on Onion shoes. Basically nothing else but a shoe that is shaped to make the bars share some of the weight the hoofwall has to deal with.

Also considering the heart-bar shoe concept, I wonder why a lot of time and effort in put in making shoes like that while in a lot of cases a good quality hoofpack works just as well?

It's not that I oppose to using heart bars, onions and similar shoes, I have used them myself and I can also see why in some cases you even can not do without.

In the majority of cases however the use of a hoofpacking (we all know we got great ones nowadays, although they're way to expensive....) is not only much easier, but also much more forgiving.

A lot of mistakes can be made using onions and heart bars, using hoofpack in stead is just much more forgiving.

So I was wondering if articles like these should be accompanied by a warning to our less experienced colleagues. Something like 'don't try this at home children' use hoofpack!

Or am I being short-sighted again?

Ronald Aalders

Name: Nate Allen

Email: natea@mesalands.edu

Ron,

I firmly believe as an educator that learning begins in Farrier programs in a controlled environment that introduces students to many of the various techniques in shoeing (including those techniques beyond nailing keg shoes on and forging steel) and continues with a good apprenticeship that leads to life long learning in each of our own careers. In my opinion, students must be introduced to these techniques and then allowed to practice them. Although schools are not the only method to build a foundation to becoming a good farrier (hard to beat the school of hard knocks), they serve as an excellent beginning for many. Our program is a two year associate degree which allows students the opportunity to learn many of these methods. For those of us practicing in the field, hands-on clinics are essential. Like students, most of us learn by doing and guidance along the way is critical in order to progress.

I am not sure of the original motivation behind the comparison between the heart bars and the hoof packing, but I am certain that they serve relatively different purposes and that one does not replace the other. From my perspective, pads and packing primarily provide protection and limited support, while the primary purpose of the heart bar is support, not so much protection. Packing will not support an acutely foundered (P3 descending)horse; on the other hand, a heart bar will not protect a horse that has a servere bruise in the sole area.

I would agree that heart bars are more difficult to fit; however, due to the potential of compressing the circumflex artery of P3 (runs around the front 2/3 of P3 at the ground surface border as shown by Pollitt), I am very cautious about sole pressure on an acutely foundered horse. I think it is difficult to say that one method is better than the other when they serve relatively different purposes.

Nate Allen

Name: Ronald Aalders

Email: ronaldaalders@planet.nl

Thank you Mr. Allen,

The reason for my posting was of course that I feel certain hoofpacking are a suitable replacement for specific types of shoes that create support through their mechanical properties.

In fact the only reason where the use of modern urethane hoofpacking can not be used and e.g. a heart bar must bhe used are situations where support is needed but the sole or heel or other parts that will be covered by the hoofpacking is open to infection.

I fully agree with the rest of your posting.

Ronald Aalders

Name: Kim Nelson

Email: kpkcnels@plateautel.net

I'll answer, Why do we need shoes?

This hoof pac or what ever you want to call it isn't magic. Let us not pretend or tell anyone else that it is. You do what you want to with it, it will never replace knowledge and skill. If you need to, go back to school. It's a cop out, it has it's place, to protect the foot, that's it. Whatever support it gives most likely is bad, though sometimes the protection is more important.



This shoeing business is hard enough. Let's be honest in the things we do and say. Hoof pack of any kind will not cure your problem!

Kim, Bell Ranch

Name: kim nelson

Email: kpkcnels@plateautel.net

Thanks for responding,

As I understand the hoof pack type material, the whole bottom of the hoof is covered. You can't concentrate the pressure in any one place. Besides the fact that the sole is not a support structure.

With bar stock you can, with a little time, a little skill, and a little patience, increase pressure where you want it, and decrease pressure where you don't want it.

The new hoof pac and hoof repair material is great, no question. It, however, will never replace shoes, correctly applied, that gives support in the right places, not a cover all.

With bar stock I know where I am giving support, maybe it is the wrong place, but I know. Hoof pac the horse goes sound, I wonder, which part am I supporting that helped?

This is all good stimulating conversation, my main reason for responding, is to make sure that new farriers don't get the idea that sole pack or anything like it, can, or will ever replace skill and knowledge.

I know using shoes for support is hard and troublesome, prone to error as you say, show me a better way. How can you apply support to the frog by pouring sole pack, or like, into the bottom of the hoof? What if you don't want pressure on the sole, which you shouldn't, but you do want it on the frog, or maybe just the bars? What if I want to support the sole only, why I don't know, how do I do that? You can't isolate the pressure or support with packing.

I hope in your time to time teaching you are showing students how to determine when to use what, and not telling them that sole pack, or chemical stuff is the answer to everything. It isn't, I think you know that.

You still didn't answer the question. Why do we need shoes?